SPEAKER_02 0:01

Hi, I'm Carrie Love, and this is another episode of Unfiltered with Love. Today I'm here with my good friend Scott Furlong. We've known each other for, I don't know, maybe 30 years now. So I asked Scott to come on and be a guest because he has a very interesting story and he's done a lot of interesting things. He was a former detective and he did end up having PTSD due to his detective work. And he's also an author. So, Scott, can you tell us a little bit about your background as a detective?

SPEAKER_00 0:39

Thank you, Kerry. Thanks for having me on. It's it's it's great. And uh I love what you're doing with your podcast because you're connecting with people, and I think that's very important, particularly in today's today's world with everything going on. Human connection's very much needed, I think. So yeah, look, I was sworn into the police service in 1999. I think you said we've known each other for about 30 years, it'd have to be yeah, 30 plus years, I think, yeah, for sure. Yeah. Mid-90s, early the mid-90s.

SPEAKER_02 1:06

But um former roommates, former roommates, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:10

Back in the good old days. So look, yeah, it was it was a joined the Queensland police. My father and grandfather were both police officers. So I joined the police, and it's where I met my wife, my now wife, my my wife of 25 years, I think, with one little boy who's 20. He's not little, he's about seven foot tall. But um yeah, so joined the police. I went into what they call plain clothes pretty much really early. I spent two years in uniform um and then went into uh plain clothes and became a detective and uh spent a lot of time in uh some time in regional police, regional as a regional detective, um, and then uh specialized and went into homicide. I was there for about 10 years. Um and then when I medically retired in 1999, I was the officer in charge of of a uh of a detective unit of about 60 odd detectives for a for a district in Queensland here.

SPEAKER_02 2:11

So what led to your PTSD?

SPEAKER_00 2:14

Well, I think it it's an occupational hazard, I think. Um really I th I think yeah it I think most police or law enforcement officers would have a form or some form or an amount of post-traumatic stress. Look, I think it's a combination of a lot of things. Um the the trauma that you see, the trauma that you go through in policing really um leads to leads to that. And I I I think it sort of it's it sort of in a in a roundabout sort of way also, I think um how you deal the the support that you're offered, how you deal with it um and and and how it it determines how it manifests itself, I think, and and how it builds up and and gradually builds up. So I was diagnosed with um major depression and complex post-traumatic stress disorder, so CTPD or PTSD CTP, yeah, which is just that um uh that ongoing exposure to the traumatic events in in your life that you see and deal with.

SPEAKER_02 3:25

Yeah. So when did things start to shift for you? So you you were dealing with that and then you got out of the police work.

SPEAKER_00 3:33

So look, I I I I knew it was bad PTSD. I was diagnosed earlier, I don't think about 2004, I was diagnosed with PTSD. But the culture of of law enforcement, uh particularly where I was, is that you just you didn't do it, you just dealt with it. You know, I I think the way I dealt with it was to um embed myself in the work that I was doing and uh just to throw myself into it. And it's very much if you it's it's taboo to I guess identify, talk about or put your hand up, which is totally, totally the wrong way to go about it, you know. Um, but that's that's what I did, and I just kept kept pushing and pushing and pushing and kept working and uh yeah, but okay, I had PTSD, it was a thing, but I did nothing about it.

SPEAKER_02 4:20

Did they offer any support?

SPEAKER_00 4:22

No, no, not really, no. They don't they there's a period that they they they did, particularly not in the early stages, it was just something that wasn't it's just not dealt with, not handled. And and look, I mean it's an organization and it opens themselves up to litigation, but so they brought in certain types of, you know, we were supposed to be, I think, uh seen by the psychologist once a year or once every couple look, I don't I think I might have seen them once, you know, because but it in in and of that it you you just you you didn't acknowledge it, you didn't you're weak if you were to do that, you know. So you never did that. You just went about I traveled to state you know, investigating murders. I mean, I know it's like you're 10 years old, it's Christmas Day, and you're just giving the keys to Toys or Us, you know, it's it was the greatest job in the world. There's no way I wanted to put any of that in jeopardy. Um and you didn't think about it, you just went, uh, you just kept pushing and kept going forward. But holy smokes, yeah. It gets to a point where you just don't have a say, you know, your body, your mind, it just takes over and um, you know, it just captures you, and it doesn't matter what you try to do here. You you just you you just you're at its mercy, you know, and you can't do anything. Yeah, just you if you it's like saying you want to turn your body left and it just turns right, you've got no control. So you just find yourself in that position, you know.

SPEAKER_02 5:52

Do you think too, like I'm what you're saying this, and we're talking about the support and how you just you know, you would if you if you tried to get support, you'd look weak. Do you think that that something to do with being a man too?

SPEAKER_00 6:05

Um but I I I think I think it's more law enforcement more generally. Like I think you know, talking earlier before you came on, and I I think I mentioned to you I've had like eight colleagues that I work with commit suicide, you know, and and some of those were female, you know, and um so it uh look, it it it it doesn't discriminate. Um it certainly doesn't. Um yeah, whether it's harder for men, I don't I don't know. I don't know. It's it's just a terribly debating uh workplace injury that you sustain and um it just grabs you and like we call it the black dog. I don't know if you call it over there, but yeah, it just keeps nipping at your heels.

SPEAKER_01 6:50

I think a like a lot of uh police officers have it.

SPEAKER_00 6:55

I've never really and to some degree, yeah. Yeah, yeah, definitely.

unknown 7:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 7:05

So when did you start to shift? So I know now you've done a lot of things though, since your time in the police. You took theology courses.

SPEAKER_00 7:12

Yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_02 7:13

So yeah, look.

SPEAKER_00 7:14

So tell me a little bit about the I think uh when everything came to a head in 2019, I uh I uh uh suffered an acute um real debilitating post-traumatic stress and medically retired. I just had this this you know, this draw, this sense of uh sense of self, sense of something else, you know, and uh it drew me to uh I guess to my faith, to my theology. And I I think you look a bit different at things, and you look a bit and and when you can stop and you can stop your mind for a certain period of time, and uh because you're I think you're always in protective protection mode, you're always in business mode, and that's how you survived is you built up walls and you protected yourself. And the way for me to do that was to throw myself into work and and and what have you. But when you stop, you start to look at things differently, I think, and you look at I guess when you look at you you look at music and you you you think of okay, I like that music, but you tend to look at the soul behind who wrote that music, you know, the all the painting, what what the soul that went into creating that piece of art that you like or cooking that that food that that that you like, you know, it's just not the steak, it's how it's cooked, how it's prepared, the person who did it. So I think when you're looking when you and you look at trauma, I don't know, and I'm not a psychologist and not a medical professional by any by any means, but I think you try to give yourself or you try to find understanding or reason as to why this these things happen and and to all the trauma in your life, and you try to look at and understand, um, you know, and make and try and make sense of what has happened and how it's happened, you know. And um I think for me that's maybe what I looked at a bit deeper and and try to to look at uh um you know, trying to look at all these sorts of reasons why, and um, I mean sometimes there is no reason, but just trying to look, I I guess and understand, I think, and have a different perspective and piece together in my mind, um, I think you know, that it's it can't be for nothing, you know. We can't be a trash society that just does away with each other. Do you know what I mean? I I know there's a lot of bad things, bad things happen, and people say, well, if if life was so good, or if if your God was so good, why do they let things happen and why do bad things happen? Um, and so there's I guess a lot of deeper underlying theological principles that might go with that, and I certainly don't understand it all, and I can't understand it. One day I might get to ask him, but um for me it's understanding that it's not all about a tit to tit for tat economy that we live in, you know. There's a deeper sense of person, of of human being behind our existence, good, bad, and ugly, because it's all one. You know, we we're all we're all we're all good, we're all bad, we're all ugly. So um it's understanding that and giving value, which I think I saw a lot of um not, I guess disvalue is not the right word, but uh a lot of um devalued people in in you know in their life, and and there's got to be greater respect, you know.

SPEAKER_02 10:51

I agree with you. And I agree with you. I like I like what you say too about seeing things behind the music and things like that, because I agree with that 100%. Yeah, because I feel like I do that now more too than I look at the things behind. It's not it's not surface level anymore. No, that's right. It's not surface level.

SPEAKER_00 11:09

So I think I did that and I was surface level because it's how I kept myself safe, you know, and how I was and I thought I'm of I it's how I valued myself as a human being. I wasn't doing this job, or I wasn't doing this, I was of value of no value. I was meaningless, I didn't have an identity. And when you transition out or you medically retire, and your identity is so taken from you that you search for well, and you have those, uh I'm worthless, so what do I do? I have no value. So you keep chasing, you know, you try and reinvent yourself and you keep chasing it. And um, like you mentioned earlier, I then went on and did a law degree. Um, did I do that? Because I thought that uh if I didn't do that, if if I was Scott Furlong working at 7-Eleven, in my mind, am I of less value than Scott Furlong? He's got a law degree, you know, perhaps. But and that's not right at all. That's that's totally wrong. We're all of value. We all have we all have a purpose in life, and it doesn't matter your status or what your name is or how many letters you've got after your name, it's it's it's it's it's how you walk upon the earth, you know, it's it's it's what you do, how you tread, how you treat people. Um, and I think I'm just even after doing that to the Lord agree at great expense, I'm just starting to come and uh identify that and learn that and and and understand it. So still in a massive transformation, still trying to find self, I guess.

SPEAKER_02 12:42

Mm-hmm. Yeah, aren't we all?

SPEAKER_00 12:44

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 12:46

We all are. So did trauma affect how you related to people? Did it change your relationships at all?

SPEAKER_00 12:53

Oh, absolutely. Yeah, yeah. My word it did. Yeah, yeah. No, I think um it's it it does. You you uh and it depends on the type of person. Like you don't form friendships or deep meaning friendships, you're hyper-vigilant of like of of my son. Uh I used to worry about because you see death occur in many different ways, whether it be a traffic crash, a homicide, accidental, you know, you it's you're just surrounded by it, and you can't help but think um, you know, at any given moment something could happen to your loved ones, to your wife, your child. And so I think it did. It it um uh it does. It it you build up a massive, massive wall to people, and you don't form those friendships because I think you try to protect yourself. Uh yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_02 13:50

And and and you're still married, yeah, which is a a good testament to like because I'm sure I was all holding that was hard.

SPEAKER_00 13:58

I was all hepped up on goofballs, you know. That's how I think I got through it. I was mad. I'm medicated. I was medicated.

SPEAKER_02 14:08

Don't have Tanisia listen to that. That's fine.

SPEAKER_00 14:11

Well, I got to the point, you know, she stuck me with me through everything, you know, through a lot, all the bad stuff. So I'm at the point now I think she's just damn bad luck.

SPEAKER_02 14:21

You know? I thought you were gonna say she's just a good lady. I think she's bad luck.

SPEAKER_00 14:32

Oh, it's good. Yeah, it's like well, you know, she was a police officer herself who was medically retired with PTSD. So she did too? Yeah, 2011. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:44

Oh, I didn't realise that.

SPEAKER_00 14:45

Well, yeah, until 2011, she medically retired, PTSD, yeah. Yeah, and so uh, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 14:53

So it's it's it's uh well but it's kind of good then but um that you have someone there with you that's kind of can at least kind of know what you're gonna do.

SPEAKER_00 15:01

Yeah, I think so, yeah. But Jesus, we ask a lot of your partners, you know. And but you don't know, you you know, and I don't know, it's it's what it is, isn't it? You know.

SPEAKER_01 15:14

Yep.

SPEAKER_02 15:16

Yep. So so we talked about you did the theology and you got your law degree, and um, and so now you have your own business. So you want to talk a little bit about that, and then and then also your books because you're an author.

SPEAKER_00 15:29

Yeah, yeah. Well, so my my and uh you know, I think going back to um that value space, and uh all I know, all I knew and I know how to do is to investigate, be an investigator. Um so my my business is um furlong and associate's investigation consultancy. So I do investigation work and consultancy work in the investigation and business space. Um, and I probably did that because it's all I know how to do, you know. Um it's all I know how to do. Um and it was it's familiar. It's something that I probably need to branch out from and br and and pivot away from. Um because it is all I know how to do.

SPEAKER_02 16:17

Because are you still getting back into the element? You're not, I mean, obviously you're not doing the same kind of work you did as a police officer, but it's still kind of investigative, right?

SPEAKER_00 16:25

Yeah, yeah, that's right. You know, you're still back in that realm. Um, but I guess it's the fear of them, what do I do? Where do I go? What do I do? Particularly at my age, that's gonna pay the bills who's gonna employ, you know, and that sort of thing. So yeah, like I said, uh it's you know, always transforming, I guess, um, and trying and and looking out a roadmap and road plan. I think I've just been so like law enforcement, you're so institutionalized and you're so structured in your thinking and in your daily habits and in your life that everything has to be structured. You know, everything you do. And it's like life is structured, it's got to be laid out, there's got to be a plan, there's got to be, you know, you're going from A to B, that you've got to have that mapped out. You know, there's not it's not just, oh, I'll try this and see what happens. You that doesn't that doesn't fit into the psyche, you know, of a of s of somebody that's been in law enforcement, I think, you know, for particularly for 20 years.

SPEAKER_02 17:30

And that's hard for me to to kind of see you that way too, because when we lived together, there was far from structure. It was very loose.

SPEAKER_00 17:41

I've got to say, we were young, loving life, yeah. Well, you know, we just thought let's go, let's go to let's go to New Orleans all the way from Brisbane. Yeah, okay, let's do that. Off we'd try, pack our bags and off we'd go. Yeah, you know.

SPEAKER_02 17:54

I don't know, maybe you gotta relive that. You just gotta just be back, go back to basically.

SPEAKER_00 17:59

That's that's right, you know.

SPEAKER_02 18:01

Forget all the stuff from between from them from them to now.

SPEAKER_00 18:06

Yeah, exactly. That's very true, you know. Maybe we've got to except got the responsibilities of child now and a house and all the stuff that goes with. Yes, adults, yes, yes, you know. But uh darn it that adults. But yeah, uh, I I need another business plan because quite clearly my business current business plan of winning the lottery isn't working, so you know.

SPEAKER_02 18:34

But but you also too, you have uh you have a lot of property there and you have horses and things like that. And I bet you that's been very healing, I'm sure.

SPEAKER_00 18:42

That's right. See, we uh Tanisha used to have horses when she was little, when when she was younger than when she joined the police or sort of fell away as you do, but when she went through her uh PTSD, it will it was it was a healing. She got back into it and it was healing, and it and it is and it saved her life. I'm absolutely no doubt about it, you know. And um, and it is is mate, let her can I just say if you're having a bad day, let a horse breathe on your soul. It is absolutely healing, and it will do fundamentally the best sort of therapy therapy you you can have. It's just uh another creature like that that is um you know just so soulful, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 19:25

And animals are like that. I mean, you you see there are a lot of programs that they do the dogs for the PTSD.

SPEAKER_00 19:30

Yeah, yeah, assistance dogs and stuff like that. So we've got dogs. We had four or five dogs at one stage, we've got two now. Um two cats, we had three cats, poor old stripes died, but um, you know, so we've got three cats, two dogs, four horses, you know. So you're gonna busy, busy then then the wild kangaroos and koals and the bird the birds, you know.

SPEAKER_02 20:00

So I heard some birds there. Yeah, I bet you do have kangaroos in your house.

SPEAKER_00 20:04

Yeah, they just come and they just come and sleep in the front.

SPEAKER_02 20:06

I know I haven't seen that in a long time.

SPEAKER_00 20:08

Yeah, yeah, they do. They just yeah, they just yeah, they're like deer.

SPEAKER_02 20:12

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 20:13

We've got some of those here too.

SPEAKER_02 20:15

Yeah, do you have deer? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, not the white-tailed deer though. Is it or different little Australian deer or something?

SPEAKER_00 20:25

Mongrel mongrel Aussie deer, you know, that'll belching steel your beer, you know. Keep going. It's right.

SPEAKER_02 20:34

Yeah, so um well, talk a little bit about your books because I know you have one that you wrote about for children, and then you have another one that you just wrote recently.

SPEAKER_00 20:44

I was still still working on that one, but so yeah, back when I was in in 2020, I wrote a book, it was called Mummy Wears Blue Shoes. So it's it's a conversation starter for what one thing that I found, particularly when Tanisha went through her period, her acute bout of PTSD, and then when I went through mine, we had Caden who was very young. How do you talk to your children about this? How do you tell them? They're seeing mum and dad crying, they've got to be going, what is going on, you know. And so this book is about Emily, who's five years old, you know, and and her brother, uh Jackson. You know, Emily wants to be a ballerina, Jackson's a rugby player. Um, and Emily notices mum, you know, has been a bit sad lately and doesn't take her to ballet lessons anymore, or doesn't take Jackson to rugby. And I I use the blue shoes as a metaphor, I guess. So she knows mum's wearing a blue shoes. So and blue because they're you know, you're blue when you when you're depressed, you're blue. So they're blue they're blue shoes. And um so one night she sees mum crying and dad can't consoling her, and then they have the family meeting and They talk about openly about what post-traumatic stress disorder is. So that mum and dad are specialist police, they're called detectives. Things have happened, and mum's unwell as a result of it. Um, and that there's a new a new way, there's going to be a new normal for them, a new, a new way of life, a new normal. And it's about readjusting and talking to children about how that affects them. Kids, they pick up on this stuff, you know. Um they for sure we don't give them enough credit, and they are resilient and they bounce back, but they they understand, they sense when things are going on, they they sense when there's been a change in the routine, they sense when there's been a change in mum and dad. Um, and I had no way, and I when I went through it and I thought, how unfair is this for Cain to get it twice? You know, how do we how do we talk to him? You know, and so I wrote this book, and um, yeah, so mummy wears blue shoes, and in the end, she paints the blue shoes pink to make mum feel better, you know. So um, yeah, it's just a heartwarming way that it's it's not a it's not meant to be a a medical text or a the uh psychological text or something or book or a self-help. It's it's a conversation starter to say, hey, read this, and you and you can then explain to your to your children, hey, I'm going through the same thing at the moment. You might have noticed that grandma and granddad are taking you to football or or taking out coming over and helping out, or I can't get out of bed and I can't do that. This is why, but it's gonna be okay, you know, that there's help and that works. So yeah, so I wrote that. And what I love about it particularly is that the the illustrations are done by my cousin, Emma. So yeah, so it's nice. It's a book about families by family, you know. So she's very talented. So I I wanted her to illustrate that for me. She's done a magnificent job, you know.

SPEAKER_02 24:02

So and then you wrote another book recently. Is it out?

SPEAKER_00 24:07

Well, I've got I've got one which is a text. It's called The Fundamentals of Government Investigation. So that's the investigation side. So it's it's a basic fundamental guide for those people that are in the investigation space, uh, conducting invest government investigations. It's just sort of like an A memoir sort of text and and what have you. So how they can help them, help them through that, you know, have a ready reference book for them. So that's also out. But I'm currently I'm saving up to get an editor for um I'm I've written uh a book called the working titles Shadows of Timbuktu. Um and being a a law nerd, it's about the International Criminal Court, it's about uh 2012 uh uprising, uh rebel uprising in uh in Timbuktu in Mali, where um you know the atrocities were committed, and a young boy Moossa, he escapes, you know, and he he gets picked up by the Red Cross, and in years later he's working in the International Criminal Court, and then the the um a former Queensland detective named Harry Covington uh starts working, he's can he's he's um contracted to help them in this investigation, and uh I won't give away too many other plot twists, but yeah, they go back to go back to Marley, they get they go back to Tim Buck too, they investigate the crimes and stuff. So it's a it's a thriller. It's a uh yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 25:42

So that's good because you can you back it up with some real life stuff.

SPEAKER_00 25:46

Well it's a fiction novel, so but it is rooted in in history, and um, you know, Harry comes from Claire in Townsville, and that's where so that the the main character Harry Covington is is a combination of my grandfathers. So my grandfather Andrew Covington, Andy Covington, and uh Harold Furlong, so Harry Covington. And uh when my grandfather uh uh Covington was uh he was a great man, he was a magnificent cheese, obviously. But um when he was uh after World War II, the Australian government had a scheme that they would give parcels of land to you could get to return vets, and he ended up in Clare in North Queensland on a cane farm up there, and so yeah, that's tied in with it and all that sort of stuff.

SPEAKER_02 26:37

I like that. I like that you have put your family in it.

SPEAKER_00 26:40

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it was. It's it's great.

SPEAKER_02 26:44

Well, thank you for being here today, Scotty, and I'm happy, you know, to have you and hear about your books and what your your your trauma to transformation. I I I you know that I feel very strongly about you as you've been a good friend for a long time, and of course, um, you know, so I'm I'm happy to see that you're doing better and doing all these things.

SPEAKER_00 27:06

Thank you so much. Uh, I really appreciate being given the opportunity. And I think what you're doing is just is great, it's wonderful. It's you know getting connection, and I think we've missed that today, like I said earlier, you know, in in our world, we I think we just need to slow down, just think about what's important, who's important, and just treat each other with a bit more compassion, tenderness, kindness, and uh, you know, yeah, I think we'll all win the race.

SPEAKER_02 27:35

I agree with you. Well, thank you. Thank you, mate.

SPEAKER_00 27:39

Take care. Bye.

SPEAKER_02 27:40

If you would like more information on Scott's books, I will post the links to his books in the description of the episode. In the meantime, this is Carrie Love with Unfiltered with Love. Thank you for being here.